(1) Bad science in sf I’m used to. On the other hand, this expose of Monty Python by medievalist Kathleen E. Kennedy is shocking! Her post for The Mary Sue, “Coconuts in Medieval England Weren’t as Rare as Monty Python and the Holy Grail Made You Think”, claims England was practically awash in coconuts – had he existed, King Arthur would have had no problem acquiring one.
(2) As a fan, when I see something like “15 Facts You Didn’t Know About the Original ‘Ghostbusters’”, I start jonesing to tell the headline writer that the original Ghost Busters was the working title of a Bowery Boys movie. But carry on….
Imagine Eddie Murphy and his fellow paranormal firefighters battling a motorcycle-riding skeleton and a giant lizard monster from their gas-station base in a futuristic New Jersey. Who you gonna call? Ghost Smashers!
By the time it became an instant classic upon its release in 1984, Ghostbusters had morphed through radically different iterations, featuring bonkers plot points and unrecognizable creatures. Those mind-blowing details are chronicled by Ghostbusters: The Ultimate Visual History, author Daniel Wallace’s revelatory, self-explanatory new book due out this week, just in time for Halloween.
(3) I stopped to watch Ray Parker Jr.’s Ghostbusters music video while researching the previous item. That 1980s video did some nice things with neon lights. But it can’t hold a candle *coff* to the Halloween Light Show set to his vocals in this YouTube video — four singing pumpkin faces, tombstones, hand carved pumpkins, strobes, floods, two Matrix boards and thousands of lights.
(4) At this hour it may be hard to find anyone who hasn’t already read John Scalzi’s Whatever post titled “Here’s the Egregious, Mealy-Mouthed Clump of Bullshit That is the 2015 World Fantasy Convention Harassment Policy”.
I am not a lawyer, but I expect that ReedPOP, the company that runs [New York Comic Con] (among many other conventions around the US) has maybe a few lawyers on its staff. If NYCC is utterly and absolutely unafraid to promulgate a harassment policy even though there is a legal statute defining what harassment means in the state of New York, I expect it might have been possible for World Fantasy to have done likewise, if they chose to do so.
And I recommend reading Jesi Pershing’s comment on the post. (I’m unable to link to specific comments on Whatever, despite both it and File 770 running on WordPress….)
(5) Trae Dorn’s story at Nerd & Tie, “World Fantasy Convention writes the worst harasssment policy ever” doesn’t live up to the hyperbole of the headline, but it reflects the prevailing mood of the internet.
(6) Jim C. Hines weighed in with “Trying to Fix WFC’s Harassment Policy Problem”.
Can this actually be fixed?
Well, no. Not completely. You’ve pissed off a lot of people, and you’ve got nine days before the start of the convention. You can’t fix it. But you can work to make it better. Here are my suggestions, for what they’re worth.
A compelling observation was quoted from Natalie Luhrs’ post —
Keep in mind that, as Natalie Luhrs pointed out, “three of the last five World Fantasy Conventions had harassment incidents that were publicized: 2010, 2011, and 2013.” This doesn’t include incidents that weren’t publicized.
However, it should be noted that other recent WFC’s have had genuine anti-harassment policies – the 2015 committee is an aberration in that respect.
(7) The headline for Arthur Chu’s post captures just what I think was really controlling SXSW’s decision to have these panels at all – “This Is Not a Game: How SXSW Turned GamerGate Abuse Into a Spectator Sport”. Chu also is very informative about the history about the anti-harassment panel proposal.
- Any “both sides” narrative is nonsense. Whatever harassment and abuse there was cannot have been at all symmetrical.
SXSW acknowledges this when they tell Randi Harper in an email they’ve “received numerous threats of violence regarding this panel (Level Up)” and a “civil and respectful environment seems unlikely.” You can see with your own eyes the degree of incivility and disrespect likely to occur at her panel by looking at the comment thread GamerGate left on PanelPicker. This started up in August and has only had time to fester since then.
By contrast, I don’t think anyone “anti-GamerGate” I’ve spoken to other than my fellow panelists was even aware a GamerGate panel was in the cards until it was announced last week. Feel free to search my own history on Twitter, Facebook, Reddit, etc. to see if you can find any mention of it.
(8) Chris Kluwe went straight for the jugular.
What you did, what you’re doing, is providing the blueprint for harassers and hatemongers as to how they win. From this point forward, any fringe group of spiteful lunatics can point to this moment and say, “We will silence the voices of anyone we dislike at SXSW, any view we disagree with, because we know the mewling slugs in charge have not the backbone to stop us. All we need to do is confront them with our vileness, and they will fold.”
And the worst part?
YOU are solely the ones responsible for this.
YOU decided that it was appropriate to give a group of harassers a platform to continue their wretched campaign of ignorance. No one forced you to bypass the application process, to slide this selection of charlatans and liars along back alley channels into the conference. (And by the way, it is beyond ironic that a group ostensibly about ‘ethics in journalism’ required such an unethical route.)
YOU chose to ignore the warnings of the women targeted, to dismiss their voices as unworthy of respect or consideration, and then had the gall to act shocked that a ‘movement’ known for its corrosive toxicity slimed its oh-so-predictable foulness in your direction after you invited them in.
(9) Today In History:
October 27, 1938 – Orson Welles’ Mercury Theatre of the Air broadcasts its adaptation of H.G. Wells’ War of the Worlds. Joe Bloch comments —
People have debated for decades just why the country was so willing to be fooled by the broadcast, and the question of whether or not Welles had an inkling of what would happen was never answered. It is certain that he denied it at a later Congressional hearing, but in subsequent interviews he answered the question rather coyly, implying that he might have known what could happen.
(10) Stop snickering about aliens, d’ye hear me? Astrophysics profession Adam Frank, co-founder of the 13.7 blog, says “Maybe It’s Time To Stop Snickering About Aliens”.
Boyajian and her co-authors considered a wide range of possibilities to explain the strange dips in the light coming from KIC 8462852. Nothing they dreamed up provided a really, really good explanation. And in the absence of that really, really good explanation, at least a few others have been thinking: “Aliens!” As Ross reports, Jason Wright of Penn State is already working on a paper suggesting we might be seeing a signature of extraterrestrial construction, a “swarm of mega-structures,” on a planetary system scale.
Now, at this point, I could start telling you about Dyson spheres and Kardashev Type II civilizations that engage in solar-system-spanning building projects (or even Vogon Constructor Fleets).
But I won’t.
That’s because the point today is not what KIC 8462852, in particular, might be telling us. The odds are high that a natural explanation will be found for the star’s flickering that has nothing to do with aliens.
Why take that stance? Well, aliens are always the last hypothesis you should consider. Occam’s razor tells scientists to always go for the simplest explanation for a new phenomenon. But even as we keep Mr. Occam’s razor in mind, there is something fundamentally new happening right now that all of us, including scientists, must begin considering.
Kepler and the many exoplanet-hunting missions coming next (JWST, PLATO, etc.) represent an entirely new way of watching the sky.
Telescope time has always been expensive — and there’s a lot of sky. In the past, astronomers didn’t have the technical capacity to continuously watch zillions of stars for long periods of time. The suns we astronomers did come back to again and again tended to be remarkable in one way or another (they flared or blew up periodically). But the exoplanet revolution means we’re developing capacities to stare deep into the light produced by hundreds of thousands of boring, ordinary stars. And these are exactly the kind of stars where life might form on orbiting planets.
(11) Tom Knighton says it’s only a “Supergirl Kinda-Review” but he covers a lot of ground as he fills in readers about last night’s series debut.
First, the casting was interesting, and I mean that in a good way. Kara (aka Supergirl for those who don’t know) is, like her cousin, raised by human parents. Her parents were played by…*drum roll please* Dean Caine of Lois and Clark and Helen Slater, the original live-action Supergirl. Honestly, it make my inner geek giddy right there.
(12) All the other old-timers showed up in the latest Star Wars trailer. Where was Mark Hamill? The director has an answer — “J.J. Abrams addresses Luke’s absence from Star Wars trailers”
When asked what’s going with Luke’s lack of appearance in the Star Wars: The Force Awakens trailers, director J.J. Abrams stated it’s part of the plan.
“These are good questions to be asking. I can’t wait for you to find out the answer,” he said. The fact Luke is being kept away from the promotional materials is “no accident,” he continued.
It actually goes a bit deeper than that. There was a leaked image of Luke Skywalker wearing what seemed to be standard Jedi robes that made the rounds, but Disney went to work pulling as many copies of the image from the internet as possible, including Twitter embeds.
(13) Gail Z. Martin suggests “Five Reasons Why Authors Do Blog Tours (And Maybe You Should, Too)” at Magical Words.
What’s a blog tour and why should you consider doing one?
A blog tour provides the opportunity for an author to be featured in guest posts on a number of other blogs, thus gaining visibility to the readers on all those sites. Likewise, an author who has a blog can do a tour on his/her own site by featuring a number of other authors on the site in a given period of time.
Two crucial elements separate a ‘blog tour’ from merely being a guest for the day on someone else’s blog. First, a blog tour generally involves guesting on multiple blogs or hosting multiple guests on your blog. And secondly, the activity occurs within a pre-defined (and advance-promoted) time period—perhaps a week or a month. In fact, blog tours work best when the bloggers and the guests promote the upcoming post—much like when a celebrity promotes being interviewed on TV. The author gets visibility, and perhaps new readers. The blogger gets traffic and well as visibility—and perhaps some of those visitors will come back time and again.
(14) Harlan Ellison is among the contributors to Jewish Noir: Contemporary Tales of Crime and Other Dark Deeds, to be published November 1.
The stories explore such issues as the Holocaust and its long-term effects on subsequent generations, anti-Semitism in the mid- and late-20th-century United States, and the dark side of the Diaspora (e.g., the decline of revolutionary fervor, the passing of generations, the Golden Ghetto, etc.).
(15) And rather like Harlan Ellison, Wil Wheaton thinks the writer should get paid. His post “you can’t pay your rent with the ‘unique platform and reach our site provides’” tells why he told HuffPo to take a hike.
(16) Here’s somebody you don’t see at fan-run conventions every day… but he’ll be at Gallifrey One in 2016:
Sir John Hurt, who brought the ‘missing link’ in the Doctor’s past — the War Doctor, from the 50th anniversary special “The Day of the Doctor” — to life, will be headlining the 2016 Gallifrey One convention, in an appearance sponsored by Showmasters Events.
(17) Remember that how that old statue of Lenin in a Ukraine town was rededicated to Darth Vader the other day? Well, sounds like old Darth is up to no good – just check out this story: “Chewbacca Arrested During Ukraine Elections”
The Wookiee is handcuffed and detained after supporting Darth Vader’s bid to be elected as Mayor of Odessa.
Yes, my friends, there’s trouble in unpronounceable city!
[Thanks to Steven H Silver, Martin Morse Wooster, Francis Hamit, JJ, and John King Tarpinian for some of these stories. Title credit goes to File 770 contributing editor of the day Daniel Dern.]
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JJ: I’m sure Kevin will see the Batlight (or being such a train aficianado, probably the Mars light, like they had on old diesel engines).
However, the answer should be that availability, not number of copies sold, is the parameter for distribution.
For example, if a specialty press only prints 400 copies of a work that, the next year, gets a regular edition from a big publisher, that is more likely to be somebody’s idea of limited distribution. (I’m pretty sure that’s close to a historic example, though I didn’t look it up.)
But it’s also true that the business meeting voters are not constrained from voting an extension by any literal number of copies or mode of distribution — if you can get them to buy your argument.
Mike Glyer: the business meeting voters are not constrained from voting an extension by any literal number of copies or mode of distribution — if you can get them to buy your argument.
The problem is that I did not find out about Chambers’ book until after this year’s Worldcon — and an exemption passed at next year’s Worldcon would be too late. 🙁
Hampus Eckeman: And you do not in any bl**dy way get to insunuate that I have said that.
I’m not “insinuating” that you’ve said that. I’m stating flat out that you’ve said that. You’ve said that even though they feel harassed by constantly being subjected to sexist jokes in what is supposed to be a professional IT environment, what they are experiencing is not really harassment.
Pick a lane, and stay in it.
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Tough one but Angel on the strength of the final season, especially “Smile Time”. Yes, I vote Angel because of the puppets!
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
More of a vote against Lost.
JJ:
We seem to have totally different definitions of harassment. I have no idea if it is a language thing (me not being a native speaker) or if you are just on purpose searching for things to attack people not agreeing with you.
Anyhow, I will not discuss this more with you. But please, in the future stay out of my sexual orientation when arguing against me. It is not in any way acceptable.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel
Eenie meenie minie mo
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel
C’mon! Vote against Joanna Lumley?
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf
Muttley swearing
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Tomorrow People [late 70s]
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New]
Hampus Eckeman: But please, in the future stay out of my sexual orientation when arguing against me. It is not in any way acceptable.
You’ve been open here about your personal life. I drew a parallel from what you’ve experienced to what other people have experienced. I am not surprised that this makes you uncomfortable. It is, however, a valid comparison. You do not get to define for other people whether or not they have been harassed.
The times when someone has harassed me – as in gone after me personally – have felt different from someone just making shitty offensive jokes or comments. Neither is an enjoyable experience but I’m not convinced using the same word for them is helpful.
Meredith: The times when someone has harassed me – as in gone after me personally – have felt different from someone just making shitty offensive jokes or comments. Neither is an enjoyable experience but I’m not convinced using the same word for them is helpful.
Do you spend a great deal of time in an environment where women are constantly being denigrated? Can you consider the possibility that women who do spend a great deal of time in such an environment might feel continually harassed?
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Survivors (13)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Cruel. Carnivale is brilliant, but can’t compete with the Doctor rebooted.
@JJ
I spend a great deal of time house-bound, but oddly enough I do vaguely remember the experience of being a women in public – and of being a woman on the internet, and of being a woman in online gaming (I think that last one probably ticks that box pretty thoroughly by itself). I’m still not a fan of equating shitty jokes with harassment, or at least not of having a black and white line and putting both of them on the same side at all times. Other women can have different lines if they like, but they don’t get to dictate mine for me any more than I get to dictate theirs for them.
I think there is a time when shitty jokes get sufficiently pervasive to have broadly similar severity, but – for me – that would have to be the pervasive atmosphere of the con not just two guys sitting behind me at one point during it. I realise that comes down to a matter of degree, but that’s where my line is. It might change in future; it has before.
Regardless of any of that, I still feel Silly but True using that particular incident as an example was essentially a derail from talking about typical con harassment and harassment policies, and an attempt to make it about a pet issue instead. And… It worked.
Meredith: I think there is a time when shitty jokes get sufficiently pervasive to have broadly similar severity, but – for me – that would have to be the pervasive atmosphere of the con not just two guys sitting behind me at one point during it. I realise that comes down to a matter of degree, but that’s where my line is. It might change in future; it has before.
And that’s my point. How many shitty jokes did this woman have to deal with every day at work? How many shitty jokes were cast in her presence at this convention? What did she hear in the elevator at the con, or in the line for coffee, or at lunch? These guys whose photo she took and uploaded were probably the 21,682nd iteration of it. At what point does a woman get to feel as though she’s had enough? At what point do we get to decide whether someone else gets to feel that they have been harassed?
JJ:
And you do not get to define when it is ok to drag my sexual orientation into a conversation to beat me on the head with it. Please stop with this.
I think what you are doing is a good reason for why people hesitate to be open with their sexuality if it differs from the majority.
@JJ
I think I already made the point that I don’t get to decide that.
This really was a very effective derail from talking about harassment policies, wasn’t it.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Bracketitude:
1. Abstain
I’ve been unable to get into Buffy. I have tried, like with Who, because it sounds great when people are talking about it. No go. We can all still be friends, though, right? right?…guys? where did everybody go?
2. Abstain again.
Angel was also a no go. I didn’t get the Boreanaz charm until Bones. But everyone is charming in Bones.
3. Twin Peaks
On the one hand, it’s the best show. Period. On the other, oh, whimper, pass the forehead cloths, please. And a tissue. Sniff.
6. Addams Family
I learned English from these people. And how to dress.
7. Stargate Atlantis
This is mostly an anti-vote for Lost.
8. Carnivale
Oh fiddlesticks, I just realised I never put Randall and Hopkirk (Deceased) – original version – on the suggestion list.
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 was amusing enough but didn’t really bring anything beyond that. Its overuse of the plot reset artifact and risible last season count heavily against it.
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
If anything I preferred Angel to Buffy.
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Due South (12)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
The man with no face that hid in photographs really creeped me out.
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
“We’ve recycled the water so many times it’s beginning to taste like dutch lager”
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
Abstain
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
Lost went badly off the rails while Atalantis had some great moments.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Carnivale (15)
Abstain, I’ve heard interesting things about Carnivale but New Who, Eccleston aside, never worked for me.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Warehouse 13 (16)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Greatest American Hero (9)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Score so far: Too early for maths
Rimward Region – Round One
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Greatest American Hero (9)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Being Human (14)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
I’m inclined to rate Buffy above Warehouse 13, which I found an entertaining but ultimately derivative piece of fluff. (Not that I have anything against fluff, mind.)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Hmm. Spinoff that failed to hold my interest versus show I don’t care about particularly at all? Well, Angel at least tried….
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
Was never a fan of Due South… Twin Peaks held my attention from the get-go, though.
4. EMPTY PLACES
Survivors (13)
Owww. Forehead cloth, please! This is a tough choice. Finally, the hard-hitting and wonderfully bleak Survivors edges it, for me, over the masterfully enigmatic Sapphire and Steel.
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human has a lot to be said for it, but Red Dwarf is an old friend indeed.
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
I have an immense nostalgic fondness for The Tomorrow People, but even that cannot disguise from me the simple fact that it was complete tat from start to finish.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
Lost has its flaws, but I will take it over the spinoff from another show I didn’t particularly care for.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Has to be the New Who, I’m afraid. No disrespect to Carnivale intended.
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Greatest American Hero (9)
Maybe it’s just me.
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Abstain from uniquely American ignorance.
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Being Human (14)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
Jaunting with the help of those hideous belts, TIM the computer, Jedekiah the evil shapeshifting robot… Ahhh, I loved this show. Even if barely anybody else remembers it.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Abstain from shy and diffident ignorance.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
This is the only show I make an effort to keep current with. Although thanks to Filer recs, I have been binge-watching Person of Interest while I crochet, lately.
Snowcrash:”You’re drifting again. Just a couple of things:”
Wait. Wha– I’m not drifting. I’m responding to a question from JJ that seriously drifted. I’m answering, because I have no issue with the drift. You’re welcome or not to follow that side discussion.
“I find it amusing that you would think that such an investigation would generally be performed with any sort of rigor if there wasn’t public pressure and outcry.”
I don’t. I find it heartbreaking that you _don’t_.
“By our, I assume you mean the US. I’m not an American, neither do I play one on TV. But I’m pretty sure it’s not a bedrock ideal of that society. It’s a principle of their criminal justice system.”
It is a bedrock ideal. However, as our society changes over time, new takes on it get built atop that bedrock. Certainly in a society as relatively free as ours, there are many diverse opinions, and growing even more diverse though. What use to be a large majority able to still see that bedrock has now become a small plurality viewing it from the high-rise top floor through ground-penetrating radar.
“Going from whistle-blowing/ citizen journalism to lynching and vigilantism is somewhat tone-deaf and hyperbolish even for an Internet discussion, IMO.”
Not at all. That was the purpose of the twit-shaming and photo harassing in one of the examples we’ve been discussing. You’re conflating different things. Whistle blowing is not solely consist of making a public spectacle of a perceived wrong. Further, our society values the sanctity of process of a proceeding. The specific choice of blowing the whistle by dropping something in the middle of the mob to incite it to act is but one of many ways to blow the whistle. In the U.S., if the spectacle is large and significant enough it can profoundly alter the ability to get justice for the possible crime. Primarily, it hampers the ability to seat an impartial jury. Proceedings may need to be postponed, jurors replaced, the venue moved, all of which fork the possible outcomes. Higher profile cases have even worse influences such as compromised roles, as the lure of media deals book signings can compromise the very protections in place we have to ensure fair trials. In short, that strategy may do more harm than good. And particularly, if the perceived crime that posted it actually wasn’t a crime at all, the spectacle may fracture communities and drive contentions or mistaken opinions to a point that it does irreparable harms. For example, a case where rape or death threats target the supposed offender because a high profile media star dozed it; only to find out that it was the wrong identity. That method supports and encourages harassment; it is harassment.
@JJ,
And that is the heart of the matter. I take the March 18, 2013 blog at face value. The tweeter was harassed. However, that long string of collective micro aggressions doesn’t mean that one joke is harassment. Hence jokers 1 and 2 may not be harasser’s but tweeter has been harassed.
The offender here is tweeters employer for putting her in a harassing environment; but only if they were made aware it was so.
Silly But True
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
While I have some, let’s say, issues with some of the choices made late in the series, I would vote for it in this pairing on the strength of “Hush” alone. And Buffy had a lot more going for it than just “Hush”. It was must-watch TV for me for years.
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
A difficult choice, as might be expected from an 8/9 pairing. But fortunately I need no forehead cloths since MY HEART IS AS COLD AND DEAD AS THE MILE-THICK ANTARCTIC ICE WHICH TRAPS ME IN THIS ETERNAL TOMB. What was I saying? Oh, yes. Greatest American Hero started strong and then sort of gradually petered out. Angel frequently didn’t seem to know what to do with itself and had some appalling lows, but it also had some stunning highs. I’ll go with Angel’s stunning highs.
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
We should all aspire to have a relationship like that of Morticia and Gomez.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Abstain because I haven’t seen Lost and I’ve heard it was amazing for a while, which makes me reluctant to vote against it sight unseen for a show I only liked. But I did want to note that I always thought Stargate Atlantis was a bit underrated, and was a well put-together show with a good ensemble cast. I actually enjoyed it the most of the various Stargate milieu shows. The episode “Michael” is a particular high point.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
A reasonably tough one for me. But while there’s a lot of uninteresting filler in Who, it sometimes produces episodes like “Blink”. I’ll vote for the highlights of Who over Carnivale, which was more consistent but never quite hit it out of the park like that.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 (16)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Greatest American Hero (9)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
Due South (12)
Difficult one. Parts of Due South were excellent. The train episode especially, but it didn’t sustain the genius.
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
Survivors (13)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human (14)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
Just for the impact Morticia’s sexuality had on me as a child.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
Stargate Atlantis (10)
Pass. Didn’t care for either
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Carnivale (15)
Rimward Region – Round One
1. Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. Angel (8)
3. Due South (12)
4. Survivors (13)
5. Red Dwarf (3)
6. Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
7. Stargate Atlantis (10)
8. Doctor Who [New] (2)
@Greg:
Sure, let’s go with that. Nothing here is my fault at all!
@Rev. Bob:
FWIW, that’s a bit of extra cognitive load come tallying time. I’m generally plowing through a bunch of posts in succession, flipping between Chrome and Excel.
This really was a very effective derail from talking about harassment policies, wasn’t it.
That seems to have been SbT’s goal all along. One might note, for example, that the PyCon incident doesn’t really have much of anything to do with the con’s harassment policy, and a whole lot to do with Twitter. Were the guys making inappropriate jokes acting in an unprofessional manner at a professional convention? Certainly. Did they deserve to be called out publicly? In my opinion, yes. Was it harassment? Possibly, and the primary person who one should look to when making that determination is the woman who was on the spot at the time. A harassment report filed with the convention was so tangential to the events as they played out that it is quite obvious that nothing of substance would have changed if it had never been filed.
But SbT got a conversation about harassment policies derailed into an extended conversation about that instead. As I said before, SbT’s agenda appears to be nothing more than pro-harasser apologetics and the desire to spread FUD about harassment policies. His actual contributions to any discussion about harassment policies are nonexistent.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 (16)2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Greatest American Hero (9)3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)Due South (12)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
Survivors (13)5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human (14)6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
Stargate Atlantis (10)8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Carnivale (15)This is the bracket I’m weakest in. In many cases I’ve only seen one, and am shamelessly voting for (or against!) it on the strength of that.
@ Meredith
“The times when someone has harassed me – as in gone after me personally – have felt different from someone just making shitty offensive jokes or comments. Neither is an enjoyable experience but I’m not convinced using the same word for them is helpful.”
A lot depends on context. I’ve been the first or almost the first woman in engineering departments a couple of times. When those who disapproved didn’t go after us as individuals, they often went after us as part of an identifiable group…women. In a hostile environment like that snide remarks and ‘dirty’ jokes about women in general were clearly intended as barbs also aimed at us as individuals. I’ve also seen where, when those types of utterances are tolerated by higher ups and/or the other men, the whole working atmosphere can deteriorate.
I often perceived such remarks as harassment that’s defined as covering “a wide range of behaviours of an offensive nature. It is commonly understood as behaviour which disturbs or upsets, and it is characteristically repetitive.”
It’s a complex issue.
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Due South (12)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Not even close for me. Even though Buffy ended poorly, Warehouse 13 seemed like a retread of Friday the 13th: The Series (A Canadian show that is kind of like Antiques Roadshow of the Damned).
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
After a fairly weak first season, Angel really started clicking, and was still getting better when it ended. Oh, Fred. QQ
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
Ouch! Due South is a lovely, sweet show, but it’s a real stretch to call it fantasy because of “ghosts.” Whereas Twin Peaks is a monument to the power of weird.
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
Survivors (13)
Abstain: I bought Sapphire and Steel based on its great cult rep and found it to be excruciatingly slooooooooow (and the effects are sub-original Who). I don’t know Survivors.
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human (14)
Abstain. RD never wowed me (I had friends that loved it, but I bounced off it); never saw BH.
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
A great little show.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
Lost: until BSG (new), the king of “we have a plan/we don’t have a plan”. First two seasons are golden; after that, insulting to the audience as they pull stuff out of their asses. The ending was not a success. SG-A was a bit light, but it did what it set out to do with its own loopy style.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
New Who has been surprisingly good over the years (although the stories have been weak for Capaldi in general); Carnivale was *great* but it was snuffed out too early.
FILE 770 LIVE-ACTION TV TOURNAMENT AND BRACKETS
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 (16)
Augh. I may need to consider forehead cloths. But I watched Buffy to the end and I still have an unwatched season of Warehouse 13 on my DVR so
Buffy
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Greatest American Hero (9)
Angel (I did watch a couple of episodes of GAH, never grabbed me)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
Due South (12)
Due South
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
Survivors (13)
pass — haven’t seen either
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human (14)
Another hard one. Both so different, both so good
Red Dwarf (Cat!)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)
Addams Family (haven’t honestly seen much of the other, but the Addams Family cannot be denied)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
Stargate Atlantis (10)
Meh for both…
Stargate Atlantis
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Carnivale (15)
pass — I haven’t seen Carnivale and the last couple of seasons of New Who are sitting on my DVR looking at me accusingly: I kind of lost interest around the Wedding of River Song
Meredith,
I agree with that definition, as well as as its widespread ubiquitousness of it used in society.
One of the big problems with agreement or even recognition as harassment hinges on the offensiveness (a spectrum within society), as well as the repetitiveness.
One could have a case where two people see something as being entirely inoffensive while the other sees the worst offense possible. The reasonable response can’t be to accommodate either whim, but to practically go with a hypothetical “reasonable person” standard. There are chronic hypochondriacs taking offense at everything just as destructive to group dynamics and wellbeing as someone who tolerates an anything goes mentality where nothing is a problem. And that level of offense could sometimes itself be harassment.
On repetition, I absolutely believe it’s a requisite element of harassment. I don’t think one can fault an individual making an individual event for the to totality of the whole. PyCon is good for trying to keep these individual events minimized as a matter of policy: the sexist jokes and presentations have been an issue in the tech industry. That’s why I think the single jokes by single people oblivious to the one taking offense were inappropriate but not harassing: they offended, which is a problem. The offenders were corrected and the offense addressed.
The trickier issue is for the harassed to speak up. The consequences are very real if they are received or addressed improperly. For example, the cons were imposing hostilities on the person, who got fed up. Was this brought up with the company? It needed to be, because it was seriously weighing on the individual. The event yielded less than desirable outcomes for all: reporters tracked them both down earlier in 2015 for a report on how social media has destroyed lives. The victim offended by the joke still lamented they remain out of full time employment two years late; we know they have been able to consult and present to like-minded communities, for example appearing as tech expert on the Rachel Maddow show; self-regulating the kinds and types of interactions that turn on opinions on offense or repetition.
The photo-harassed lamented the profound and perilous impacts to his and his family’s well being and noting new employment was found in a workplace which employed no women at all.
Both are relatively extreme solutions to the offense and repetition aspects. Both left the wider communities to decrease the chances of problem experiences for them.
If a smaller community whose tastes are absolutely known, the policies become much easier to draft and enforce. However as those smaller communities grow increasing repetition, and grow more diverse introducing a wider offense spectrum, then the needs increase.
Silly But True
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
TV Bracket
1. Buffy the Vampire Slayer
2. Abstain – only seen Angel.
3. Twin Peaks
4. Sapphire and Steel
Survivors just seemed like a post-apocalyptic soap opera.
5. Red Dwarf
Forehead cloth required, but I like space opera and RD is set in space, so that clinches it.
6. Tomorrow People
Laughable acting and effects in TP, but Addams Family not SFnal enough for me.
7. Stargate Atlantis
8. Doctor Who [New]
22 points so far on my unverifiable spreadsheet. I thought Enterprise would beat Wild Wild West.
Meanwhile, in another part of the galaxy…
1-3. Abstain
4. Sapphire and Steel
5. Red Dwarf
6-8. Abstain
snowcrash says:
The Suck Fairy might have nibbled a little at the early and late episodes, but I promise you the height of the series is still really, really good. Also, the new seasons that started a couple years ago have turned out to be totally worth the trouble of getting everyone back together.
@SbT
What? That sentence doesn’t appear to be making any sort of sense.
I call it drifting as your last couple of posts include a great deal of beating around the bush while failing to approach anything resembling a point. None of what you’re saying counters the need for cons to have and to enforce an effective code of conduct (effective to me means having a clear adjudication process as well as some level of discretion).
Almost everything that you say is off on some sort of tangent, or puts you in the running for the Tuomas Vainio Award for Stating the Bloody Obvious as Dazzling Revealed Truth (i.e., that different people have different ideas as to what is harassment). Try and get back to something reasonably approximating a point please.
JJ on October 30, 2015 at 12:44 am said:
Hampus Eckeman: But please, in the future stay out of my sexual orientation when arguing against me. It is not in any way acceptable.
You’ve been open here about your personal life. I drew a parallel from what you’ve experienced to what other people have experienced. I am not surprised that this makes you uncomfortable. It is, however, a valid comparison. You do not get to define for other people whether or not they have been harassed.
I understand the heat of the argument and all, but it is certainly ironic in a discussion of harassment to see something like this.
If someone tells you your discussion of their sexuality has made them uncomfortable, the only possible response is to apologize and drop it.
It does not matter if the person himself has alluded to it previously.
It doesn’t matter if you think it made a great example of something.
It’s not okay.
You can make your point without making it personal.
I thought it might be interesting to look at how the top seeds in the 21st century SF bracket would have done if I’d given them numbered, regional seeds in a way similar to this one.
The #1 seeds for the four regions would have been:
Diplomatic Immunity, Ancillary Justice, Lock In, Accelerando
The #2 seeds for the four regions would have been:
Look to Windward, Embassytown, Anathem, Blindsight
How did they do?
Diplomatic Immunity made it into the finals, eventually taking second place.
Ancillary Justice made it into the finals, eventually taking first place.
Lock In made it to the quarter-finals, where it lost to Diplomatic Immunity.
Accelerando made it to the quarter-finals, where it also lost to Diplomatic Immunity.
Look to Windward made to it the Group Of (slightly-larger-than) 16, where it lost in a close upset match to Fledgling, which was about 20th in the nominations, so figure around a #5 seed in the regionals. Fledgling would go on to make it all the way to the semi-finals, where it lost to Ancillary Justice.
Embassytown made it to the quarter-finals, where it lost to Ancillary Justice.
Anathem made it to the finals and came in third place.
Blindsight wouldn’t have made it to the Group of 16; it would have been eliminated in its second regional match in a close upset loss to Annihilation, which, like Fledgling, would have been around a #5 in the regionals. Annihilation went on to the Group of (Slightly More Than) 16, where it lost to Lock In in a close match.
Also of interest:
Farthing (about a #4 seed) made it to the quarter-finals.
Leviathan Wakes (about a #4 seed), The Lost Steersman (about a #8 seed), and The Girl With All The Gifts (about a #14 seed!) all made it to the semi-finals.
@Kyra:
Ms. Justineaux! We punched above our weight!
@Snowcrash
Forgive me, I’m not accustomed to responding to direct points by those not actually seeking such a response.
You said: “I find it amusing that you think that such an investigation would generally be performed with any sort of rigor if there wasn’t public pressure and outcry.” Making two points to which I made two responses.
I don’t [find it amusing].
I find it heartbreaking that you _don’t_ [think that such an investigation would generally be performed with{out} any sort of rigor if there wasn’t public pressure and outcry.]
The point on recording police misconduct along with some others I’ve commented on is tangential. It was _not_ my point. I was happy to respond as it was directed to me. Regarding tangential conversations, you’re welcome to follow or not. That’s your choice. There are multiple conversations taking place, and you shouldn’t feel a need to take part in them all.
If only JJ and I indulged his police photo topic, I’m good with that, and you should be too. You also responded, so we presume you also find it interesting, no?
A conversation about the conversation is even more pointless and tangential, so your objections aren’t on that principle.
Silly But True
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Due South
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis
Rimward Region – Round One
*grimly sets stack of forehead clothes within easy reach*
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 (16)Ok, I can do this. I like Warehouse 13, but the good episodes of Buffy were excellent and I can’t remember any Warehouse episodes rising that high.
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Greatest American Hero (9)3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Twin Peaks (5)
Due South (12)
Abstain – didn’t watch enough of either of these to make a call.
4. EMPTY PLACES
Sapphire and Steel (4)
Survivors (13)
Abstain – Ditto
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
Being Human (14)
So, I think Being Human may be the better show, but Red Dwarf has nostalgia. I haven’t watched it in a long time. Oh, wait, this is the American Being Human? I didn’t watch that, so I must Abstain. (ha, dodged a decision)
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
Tomorrow People [late 70s] (11)7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)Stargate Atlantis (10)
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
Carnivale (15)
And, again, I get to dodge a decision as I have not seen Carnivale. Yay! I have both lots of love and lots of problems with new Who.
FWIW, I believe that any place in the tournament there’s a UK-originated show later redone as a US show, the tournament entry is the UK version. I’m not sure any American remakes even made the field of 64.
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
The one to beat
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
abstain
3. AN EXPERT IS ANYONE FROM OUT OF TOWN
Due South (12)
for the fanfic, and also for the “not collapsing into a smoking pile of wtf in Season 2”
4. EMPTY PLACES
abstain
5. ROOMMATE TROUBLES
Red Dwarf (3)
arrgh, you made me choose
6. YESTERDAY’S PEOPLE VS. TOMORROW’S PEOPLE
Addams Family (6)
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Stargate Atlantis (10)
for the fanfic. And the not collapsing into a smoking pile of wtf.
8. TRAVELERS
Doctor Who [New] (2)
FILE 770 LIVE-ACTION TV TOURNAMENT AND BRACKETS
Rimward Region – Round One
1. IN EVERY GENERATION THERE IS A CHOSEN ONE. COED OR STORAGE FACILITY, DEPENDING.
Buffy the Vampire Slayer (1)
Warehouse 13 (16)
2. LEAVING INFAMOUS NAMES BEHIND
Angel (8)
Greatest American Hero (9)
Childhood nostalgia? Maybe.
7. ISLANDS IN THE BRACKETS
Lost (7)
Stargate Atlantis (10)
Still pissed at Lost.
@Jim,
In that case, I vote for Being Human then.
@Cally, can I set up a recurring forehead cloth pack subscription?