Pixel Scroll 1/9/21 Magnetic Monopology: Do Not Exceed C, Do Not Collect 200 Zorkmids

(1) NOT MY FAULT. The designer of the coin that shows H.G. Wells’ Martian tripods with four legs, Chris Costello, is passing the buck to the unknown artist of an old paperback cover which he displays as part of the following statement:

It appears that I have once again drawn ire from the sci-fi community. First it was the Papyrus/AVATAR thing, and now this. No disrespect to H.G. Wells or any of you. To give more context, I will share about this specific coin design challenge and my creative process on a permanent page next month, but for now…

The characters in War of the Worlds have been depicted many times, and I wanted to create something original and contemporary. My design takes inspiration from a variety of machines featured in the book—including tripods and the handling machines which have five jointed legs and multiple appendages.

(2) WHAT YOU’D EXPECT AT BAEN. Tom Kratman is coaching the next stage of the insurrection in the storefront window. Here’s an excerpt from a comment made in his Baen’s Bar author forum.

So where do Trump and the nation go from here?

He needs to do three things; start his own news channel, start his own party, and start his own well-armed militia as part of the party.

The militia – again, a _well_armed_ militia – is necessary to present a threat in being to the powers that be such that, should they use extra-, pseudo-, and quasi-legal means to try to suppress the party, the price presented will be far too high.  The militia will be heavily infiltrated; this is a given.  No matter; it will not be there for any purpose but to present a serious threat of major combat, and the shame of defeat, and the reality of death, to the tactical elements, police and military, that may be used against the party.

It ought to be made clear that, “I can start the civil war with a stamp of my foot.  I’ve refrained, so far, but you cannot count on that restraint under all circumstances.  And if I am infiltrated, you are even more so.”

The militia should probably be neatly but simply uniformed, nothing flashy.  Solid colors, no camo.  Haircuts and facial hair trimmed.  A simple shirt and bluejeans for non-firearms related activities / head busting….

(3) WHEN AUTHORS DON’T GET PAID. Sff critic Paul Kincaid shares an email he has written to the publisher that has announced a book containing his essay which they didn’t buy the rights to. It begins — 

Following my ongoing posts relating to the unexpected appearance of my essay in Science Fiction published by Routledge, I have just sent the following email to Taylor & Francis. Let us see what sort of response this brings….

(4) TA-NEHISI COATES’ BLACK PANTHER FINALE. The Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda Saga continues next month in Black Panther #23, which hits the stands on February 24. Featuring art by Daniel Acuña and Ryan Bodenheim, the issue marks the beginning of the epic conclusion of Ta-Nehisi Coates’ redefining work on Black Panther that began in 2016.

Deep in space, T’Challa has discovered an alternate Wakandan society. Known as the Intergalactic Empire of Wakanda, these ruthless warriors present a dark reflection of T’Challa’s kingdom. Having abandoned their peaceful ways, this powerful empire looks to conquer the cosmos… and Earth’s Wakanda is their next target. This daring, thought-provoking take on the Black Panther mythology also features surprising developments for supporting characters such as Shuri, Storm, and Black Panther’s greatest foe, Erik Killmonger.

(5) JEWISH SF. Jewish Museum of Maryland will host a panel discussion “People of the (Futuristic) Book” on March 4 at 7:00 Eastern about Jewish science fiction with Steven H Silver, Valerie Estelle Frankel and Michael A. Burstein.

What makes a science fiction story Jewish? Jewish writers have worked in the science fiction genre since the very beginning, thought you might not always know it from reading their work. But some stories are clearly Jewish, whether through tone and theme or explicitly based on Jewish ideas and culture. Join us for an exploration of Jewish sci-fi and fantasy – and a discussion of what makes them Jewish stories.

This Zoom event is presented by the museum in relation to the special exhibit Jews in Space: Members of the Tribe in Orbit, on view through April 11, 2021. 

(6) COMING ATTRACTIONS. Leah Schnelbach lines up “The Most Anticipated Sci-Fi and Fantasy Books of 2021” at Book Marks, including Andy Weir’s next novel.

Project Hail Mary by Andy Weir
(Ballantine Books, May 4)

The author of The Martian and Artemis is back with another interstellar thriller! When Ryland Grace wakes up in a small makeshift spacecraft, he can’t remember his own name—but that’s not even his biggest problem. Why is he on this ship? And should he know the two corpses who are on the ship with him?

As his memories return, he realizes that he’s been asleep for a very, very long time. His ship was thrown together by dozens of different governments. And, unfortunately, his mission is to stop a terrifying threat which, if it reaches Earth, will mean the destruction of the human race. If only he had any idea how to do that.

(7) REDISCOVERING THE WRITER IN AMERICA. On Todd Mason’s Sweet Freedom blog he collects links to the 1963 KQED documentary Take This Hammer with James Baldwin, and Toni Morrison, Janet Flanner and “Ross Macdonald” and others on The Writer In America, and producer/director/editor/interviewer Richard O. Moore. Mason says, “With luck, I might find some more of these. I’d hope this would be the kind of thing World Channel would be dusting off, along with Take This Hammer.” About the link to the Toni Morrison episode of The Writer In America he says, “These old film or video source copies certainly mangle their fine musical soundtracks, but Morrison’s voice particularly manages to retain its musicality.” 

KQED’s mobile film unit follows author and activist James Baldwin in the spring of 1963, as he’s driven around San Francisco to meet with members of the local African-American community. He is escorted by Youth For Service’s Executive Director Orville Luster and intent on discovering: “The real situation of Negroes in the city, as opposed to the image San Francisco would like to present.” He declares: “There is no moral distance … between the facts of life in San Francisco and the facts of life in Birmingham. There is no moral distance … between President Kennedy and Bull Connor because the same machine put them both in power. Someone’s got to tell it like it is. And that’s where it’s at.” Includes frank exchanges with local people on the street, meetings with community leaders and extended point-of-view sequences shot from a moving vehicle, featuring the Bayview Hunters Point and Western Addition neighborhoods. Baldwin reflects on the racial inequality that African-Americans are forced to confront and at one point tries to lift the morale of a young man by expressing his conviction that: “There will be a Negro president of this country but it will not be the country that we are sitting in now.”

(8) INSIDE HOLLYWOOD. Interesting discussion about making Terry Gilliam’s classic film. “The oral history of 12 Monkeys, Terry Gilliam’s time travel masterpiece” at Inverse.

Charles Roven (producer): I was given the short film La Jetée by Chris Marker by a gentleman by the name of Robert Kosberg. I then gave that to Dave and Jan [Peoples].

David Peoples (screenwriter): We had missed seeing La Jetée in the ‘60s when we should have seen it. They sent us a terrible video of it, but in spite of the fact that it was an awful video, it really was such a wonderful movie. We said, “We’ll spend a weekend on it and see if there’s anything we can come up with that would be interesting.” It did come to us that people hadn’t been doing a lot of stuff with the threat of germs – man-made germs or germs from nature. We had an image of a city with no people and just animals roaming around, totally out of place. Chris [Marker] hadn’t said it was OK to make a movie out of his movie. He hated all Hollywood movies except Vertigo.

Janet Peoples (screenwriter): We bumped into a friend of ours from Berkeley: Tom Luddy. Tom laughed and said, “Oh, I know Chris. You know, Chris loves Francis Coppola. And Francis is in town.” So we all met at a Chinese restaurant – writers and a couple of directors; no producers, no suits – and Chris Marker at one end of the table and Francis at the other. Francis looks up and says, “Chris!?” and Chris says, “Yes, Francis?” and Francis says, “Jan and Dave want to make this movie. They’re good people; I think you oughta let them do it.” And Chris says, “Oh, OK, Francis.”…

(9) MEMORY LANE.

  • 1991 — Thirty years ago, Ellen Kushner’s Thomas the Rhymer wins both the Mythopoeic Fantasy Award and the World Fantasy Award. (It was the last single Award given out before it was split into into Adult and Children’s Awards.) Based off Thomas the Rhymer myth who was carried off by the Queen of Elfland and returned having gained the gift of prophecy.  

(10) TODAY’S BIRTHDAYS.

[Compiled by Cat Eldridge and John Hertz.]

  • Born January 9, 1886 – Walter Brooks.  Two hundred stories; ours are two dozen about Mister Ed, a talking horse (these got onto television), and two dozen novels about Freddy the Pig and more talking animals on the upstate New York farm of a man named Bean.  The Freddy books have some science fiction; Uncle Ben, Mr. Bean’s brother, is an inventor, and beside that some Martians show up (Freddy and the Baseball Team from Mars).  As with much good art, what matters is less the so-called contents than the manner of telling, at which Freddy is deft and enough fun to please both The NY Times and The Imaginative Conservative.  (Died 1958) [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1890 – Karel Capek.  (The software won’t allow a caron over the C, a diacritical mark like a showing the has the sound of ch in English chat.)  Three novels for us, as many others; thirty shorter stories for us, as many others; timeless for the play R.U.R. (Rossum’s Universal Robots) introducing the word robot (although, being chemical not mechanical, they’re what we’d later call androids) and portraying the fundamental unease about them.  (Died 1938) [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1906 – Barbara Sleigh.  Five novels, four anthologies for us; two other novels, shorter stories, radio scripts, film criticism, picture books, memoirs.  Best known for books about Carbonel the King of Cats.  (Died 1982) [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1925 Lee Van Cleef. The Warden of the Prison in Escape from New York but he was best known for acting in Spaghetti Westerns. Genre wise, he was also Col. Stone in The Beast from 20,000 Fathoms, and Dr. Tom Anderson in Corman’s It Conquered the World. (Died 1989.) (CE) 
  • Born January 9, 1931 Algis Budrys. I am trying to remember what I read by him and I think it was Some Will Not Die which I remember because of the 1979 Starblaze edition cover. I’ve also read and enjoyed his Rogue Moon. Setting aside his work as a writer which was exemplary, he was considered one of our best genre reviewers ever reviewing for GalaxyMagazine of Fantasy and Science Fiction, and wrote genre reviews even in the more mainstream Playboy. He edited a number of the L. Ron Hubbard Presents Writers of the Future anthologies which I’ll admit I’ve not read any. I should note his Tomorrow Speculative Fiction prozine was quite excellent.(Died 2008.)  (CE) 
  • Born January 9, 1950 David Johansen, 71. He’s the wisecracking Ghost of Christmas Past in the oh-so-perfect Scrooged, he played Halston in Tales from the Darkside: The Movie in “The Cat from Hell” episode, and he appeared as a character named Brad in Freejack. I think the brief Ghost of Christmas Past riff in the aforementioned Scrooged is enough to earn him as Birthday Honors here. (CE) 
  • Born January 9, 1955  J. K. Simmons, 66. You may know him as J. Jonah Jameson in the various Spider-Man films but I find his more interesting genre role to be as Howard Silk in the Counterpart series where he plays two versions of himself in two versions of parallel Berlins in a spy service that may or may not exist. He also portrayed Commissioner James Gordon in Justice League. (CE) 
  • Born January 9, 1957  — Greg Ketter, 64.  Leading Minneapolis fan and bookseller; chaired Minicon 40-41 and the 1993 & 2003 World Fantasy Conventions; Guest of Honor at DucKon 16; has written for Rune and Minneapa; published the DreamHaven Fortieth Anniversary Scrapbook having earned his way there with a press so named and a shop, which last year suffered but is thankfully recovering from a disaster.  [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1954 – Philippa Gregory, Ph.D., age 67.  Half a dozen novels for us; thirty others (half about Plantagenets and Tudors), also picture books.  Outside our field The Other Boleyn Girl won the Romantic Novel of the Year Award; it and successors are also bemoaned as failing the historical accuracy they’re promoted for.  PG’s charity Gardens for the Gambia has dug two hundred low-budget wells, teaches bee-keeping, and funds batik and pottery workshops.  [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1975 – Gunnhild Øyehaug, age 46.  Two dozen of her short stories for us available in English, see the collection Knots.  Also poetry, teaching, criticism.  Co-edits literary journal Kraftsentrum (in Norwegian).  Dobloug Prize.  [JH]
  • Born January 9, 1976 Jenna Felice. Tor Books Editor. She suffered what the doctors are called a massive allergic reaction compounded by asthma. She died having never emerged from her coma. There’s a memorial page for her here. (Died 2001.) (CE)
  • Born January 9, 1981 Julia Dietze, 41. She’s Renate Richter in Iron Sky: The Coming Race, a Finnish-German film in which the Nazis are occupying the moon after a nuclear war. (It garnered a 31% rating by reviewers at Rotten Tomatoes. And yes critics were really, really hostile.) It wasn’t her first bad film as she was Princess Herzelinde in 2  Knights: In Search of the Ravishing Princess Herzelinde (1+ 1 / 2  Ritter – Auf der Suche nach der hinreißenden Herzelinde) which it won’t surprise you  didn’t exactly make the German reviewers gush over it. (CE)

(11) COMICS SECTION.

(12) TAKING TO THE LIFEPODS. Alexandra Petri provides some much-needed comic relief in “I see no choice but to resign from this Death Star as it begins to explode” at the Washington Post.

It is with a heavy heart and a deep sense of responsibility that I must submit my resignation, effective immediately, from my post on this Death Star. However, I see no other choice.

Now is the time for all of us to stand up from our posts and do what is right.It’s been an honor to work on this Death Star. I love the aesthetic. I love how I’ve been able to pursue my greatest passion: destroying planets and pressing buttons. I love my little hat that is a sunshade for no reason!

(13) GOTHAM’S SISTER CITY, ISTANBUL. Take a look at “Turkey’s legacy with sci-fi and superheroes in film” at Daily Sabah.

Last week marked the start of Turkey’s first-ever science fiction television series, “Ak?nc?,” which tells the story of an Ottoman superhero tasked with guarding over the Istanbul of Sultan Mehmed II, also known as Mehmed the Conqueror, in contemporary times.

A teacher by day and a superhero by night, the handsome Ak?nc?, whose name refers to the advanced troops of the Ottoman Empire, is tasked with stopping terrorism while being followed by an equally attractive female journalist who has been on his trail for the past three years. An enthralling and entertaining watch, the highly anticipated Ak?nc? premiered on Jan. 1 and will continue to air on Friday evenings at 8 p.m. on ATV.

In light of this exciting addition to Turkish primetime television, which is also the first of its kind within the genre of science fiction and superhero television series, it might be an opportune time to reflect back on Turkey’s famous legacy of its films in these genres….

(14) SF2 CONCATENATION HERALDS SPRING WITH NEW ISSUE. [Item by Jonathan Cowie.] The latest edition of SF2 Concatenation is now up. The spring season sees the return of a full news-page and the return of its forthcoming SF and fantasy books listings.

SF2 Concatenation is about the only place on the net with a forthcoming books listing from several genre imprints and major UK publishers.

As done every January, SF2 Concatenation has its choices as to the Best SF books and Best SF films of the previous year.  Just a bit of fun, yes, but over the years every year, one of either their choices of books or films, often both, subsequently go on to be short-listed for a major award (Hugo, Nebula, BSFA, Locus etc.) some even win.  See their track record (scroll down).

Also in the mix are half a dozen articles covering conrunning, publishing, fanzines, convention reviews and an SF diary, as well as another in the series of articles by SF author scientists on their science heroes. Plus there’s over 30 standalone fiction reviews. Hopefully something for everyone.

v31(1) 2021.1.15 — New Columns & Articles for the Spring 2021

v31(1) 2021.1.15 — Science Fiction & Fantasy Book Reviews

v31(1) 2021.1.15 — Non-Fiction SF & Science Fact Book Reviews

(15) VIDEO OF THE DAY. What will NASA be doing this year?

Sending the first Artemis mission to the Moon in preparation for human missions, landing a new rover on Mars, and launching the James Webb Space Telescope into space, expanding our ability to see deep into the universe, are just a few of the things NASA has planned for 2021.

[Thanks to Andrew Porter, Steven H Silver, Mike Kennedy, Martin Morse Wooster, Cat Eldridge, John King Tarpinian, John Hertz, JJ, Mlex, Todd Mason, Jonathan Cowie, Michael Toman for some of these stories. Title credit goes to File 770 contributing editor of the day Daniel Dern.]

144 thoughts on “Pixel Scroll 1/9/21 Magnetic Monopology: Do Not Exceed C, Do Not Collect 200 Zorkmids

  1. (2) I should be shocked, but I’m not.

    I wonder if this article could be pertinent:
    https://www.military.com/daily-news/2020/01/29/military-retirees-can-be-court-martialed-after-all-appeals-court-decides.html

    I used to buy a lot of Baen books — more than those of most other publishers, particularly fantasy. (This was when they had two logos, one for SF and one for fantasy.) They did have a lot of fun books! But over time, the range and variety of stories in both the SF and fantasy lines changed. I bounced off a lot of their books and stopped buying as many Baen books. Too many authors (and sometimes the publisher) were making Statements. There was also a lot of snide criticism of other SF/F publishers. Bleargh. The books stop being fun then.

    Also, I think a book can be great and fun — without qualifying for a Hugo or a Nebula award. That’s why I like that there are other awards out there now — such as the Dragon Awards and the Stabby Awards — that can go to books that can be fun. But Baen does not have a monopoly on fun SF/fantasy books.

    (10) Does anyone remember a 1980s edition of Algis Budry’s “Rogue Moon” that said “Rouge Moon” on the spine? Was it published by Questar or by Bluejay Books?

    I might still have one of Algis Budrys’ rejection slips. (He went out of his way to give personalized rejections! I don’t know how he found the time.)

  2. People are really hung up on the Puppies. To the best of my knowledge the Sad Puppies were active for a couple of years. The Mad Puppies, who co-opted them might be.

    Maybe it has something to do with how thoroughly those assholes ruined Sasquan for me. (But then, I was one of the Hugo Administrators who had to deal with them directly.)

    John

  3. Elspeth: People are really hung up on the Puppies. To the best of my knowledge the Sad Puppies were active for a couple of years.

    John Lorentz: Maybe it has something to do with how thoroughly those assholes ruined Sasquan for me. (But then, I was one of the Hugo Administrators who had to deal with them directly.)

    A lot of Worldcon members will permanently have problems with the Puppies because of all of the horrible things they said and did — including repeatedly accusing Worldcon members of being liars and cheaters and subjecting them to harassment and abuse, putting utter crap and pornography onto the Hugo finalist lists that will stay on the records forever, and depriving works and authors which had rightly earned it of their place on the ballot.

    Not to mention the fact that the Sad Puppies are still active, and still hurling unprovoked, unearned vitriol and abuse at Worldcon members and Hugo finalists. People who aren’t active enough on the internet to be aware of this shouldn’t be pretending that going to Worldcons somehow makes them an expert and making uninformed claims about it.

    Anyone who thinks that Worldcon members share a consensus about anything other than that cheating on the Hugos is bad should be getting out and about more while they’re at Worldcon, and seeing what the members are really like.

  4. Anne Marble says I wonder if this article could be pertinent:
    https://www.military.com/daily-news/2020/01/29/military-retirees-can-be-court-martialed-after-all-appeals-court-decides.html

    Huh. It’s a definite head shaker. I think it’s a matter of if they’re on reserve duty status and thereby still subject to UCMJ. Certainly the fact that NCIS got involved would suggest that was the case as NCIS has no jurisdiction over retired members. Military case law is not nearly as simple as civilian law is.

  5. JJ says Anyone who thinks that Worldcon members share a consensus about anything other than that cheating on the Hugos is bad should be getting out and about more while they’re at Worldcon, and seeing what the members are really like.

    I think we share a consensus that we expect that we’ll be treated with courtesy and politeness. And that our views will be not attacked when discussed in conversation in public forums. Those areas more than anything is where I think the Puppies fail as fans as they very painfully lack those traits.

  6. I love the way these clowns wave their hands blithely and say ‘he can just start his own tv channel’. I’m sure that will work out well. Assuming Trump actually HAS the many, many millions necessary, he hasn’t been willing to invest his own money in a business in many years. I expect he’d find investors thin on the ground. But if he DID get it up off the ground, he’d have to get the cable companies to carry it, at least two of which hate Trump with the burning fires of a thousand suns. And of course, given Trump’s general level of (in)competence at pretty much anything….

  7. rochrist says I love the way these clowns wave their hands blithely and say ‘he can just start his own tv channel’. I’m sure that will work out well. Assuming Trump actually HAS the many, many millions necessary, he hasn’t been willing to invest his own money in a business in many years. I expect he’d find investors thin on the ground. But if he DID get it up off the ground, he’d have to get the cable companies to carry it, at least two of which hate Trump with the burning fires of a thousand suns. And of course, given Trump’s general level of (in)competence at pretty much anything….

    Let’s keep in mind that it’s going to be damn hard for anything to replace Twitter that really he treated like mental diarrhea. He tweeted as many as a hundred times a day. No other medium is going to work that way, as I said, mental diarrhea — wet, messy and smelly.

  8. Note a parallel between the Puppies and the current insurrectionists: both are convinced that because they didn’t win, there must be Fraud, despite all evidence to the contrary. They deny all evidence and make unprovable claims, and any contrary evidence is rejected as proof of the conspiracy theory.

    I guess we’re just lucky they didn’t decide to storm the 2015 WSFS Business Meeting in an armed uprising. And don’t think I wasn’t worried about it.

  9. (2) As an Army Vet I can only say one thing: That man is a disgrace to the uniform.

  10. Like Anne Marble, I used to buy a lot of Baen books. Back when I was primarily buying paper-based books, I don’t think “publisher” was close to my decision chain, but once I started moving over to primarily ebooks, Baen was a handy place to buy them (and you also had the Baen monthly bundles that provided a handy way of buying them).

    But, having ended up with several books that I found problematic through the bundles, then the whole puppy thing, I ended up with a mental “do not buy a bundle with…” list, and with 6-8 consecutive months having had these authors in the bundle, I think it’s now been multiple years since I last visited Baen’s ebook store. Because, you know, the results are likely to be the same.

    I do buy ebooks from other ebook stores, but I suspect that Baen books are imply not on them.

  11. @Cat Eldridge

    Yeah, the exact consequences of that USSC decision are not entirely obvious to me. They declined to hear the case (essentially saying the lower court was right that Larrabee got judged under the UCMJ), but that is muddled by the fact that Larrabee was in the Naval Reserve.

    The way I read it, if you keep your commission and draw a pension, you’re subject to the UCMJ. But it might take another 1 or 2 cases to make that really clear, and I don’t know if there is an enterprising JAG officer who wants to make Kratman the test case.

  12. I’m trying to read Naomi Novik’s new novel, A Deadly Education, and I’ve got to say that I’m struggling. It’s about a Magic School for Teenagers, which is not high on my interest list to begin with, the first chapter is a massive infodump, and the entire thing appears to be written in Iambic Petulanteenager, which is nowhere on my list of favorite types of prose. I’m going to try alternating chapters with reading Cassy’s discussion group for the book, to see if I can keep going, but… I suspect that this book is Not For Me.

  13. Joe H. on January 10, 2021 at 9:08 am said:
    And aren’t the Vorkosigan books being republished/self-published by Lois McMaster Bujold these days?

    They appear to be self-published in the UK.

  14. Camestros Felapton on January 9, 2021 at 8:51 pm said:
    2) Gosh if only there was a name for a right-wing ideology that combined populism & anti-leftism with a paramilitary wing and military trappings. A fascinating facsimile of a fascia or fascicular fasciate fascicles

    I see where you are going with this but from what I can tell, these folks call themselves libertarian in the US.

  15. rob_matic: I see where you are going with this but from what I can tell, these folks call themselves libertarian in the US.

    Well, your train of thought is far elevated from mine. I thought he was going for “faeces”. 😀

  16. If Baen is letting their forums be used for calling for violence and military insurrection, then I expect Toni Weisskopf to be called out for it every time she shows her face at DisCon 3. She should not have one second in peace without being held to account.

  17. @Mart:

    Thread #1, Kratman fanboi says that the real resistance has gone quiet because “we are much better at OpSec than the left”.

    So the lurkers support them via secure channels?

  18. Mart says The way I read it, if you keep your commission and draw a pension, you’re subject to the UCMJ. But it might take another 1 or 2 cases to make that really clear, and I don’t know if there is an enterprising JAG officer who wants to make Kratman the test case.

    Ok so they’re keeping their commissions? That means indeed that they are considered active reserve and are subject to recall to active duty at any time that is deemed needed. If so, that indeed makes them subject to the the code of conduct provisions of the UCMJ as they are still considered Officers.

    This has been done with medical personnel in the military for use in case of civil disasters. No need to reactivate them as they’re still active in case they’re needed. I think technically it means they’re not drawing retirement pay at all.

  19. Hampus Eckerman wisely notesIf Baen is letting their forums be used for calling for violence and military insurrection, then I expect Toni Weisskopf to be called out for it every time she shows her face at DisCon 3. She should not have one second in peace without being held to account.

    Very, very good point.

    I admit I am surprised that DisCon 3 invited her and equally surprised that she agreed to show up as a guest given that she’s not exactly a friend of the Hugo community.

    Now playing: Peter, Paul and Mary’s “Light One Candle” because it seems appropriate.

  20. Cat Eldridge: I admit I am surprised that DisCon 3 invited her and equally surprised that she agreed to show up as a guest given that she’s not exactly a friend of the Hugo community.

    DisCon 3’s GoH roster indicates that that particular Worldcon has some major Puppy sympathizers very high up in the hierarchy. More than one of them were very vocal advocates of the Puppies and opponents of EPH.

  21. DisCon 3’s GoH roster indicates that that particular Worldcon has some major Puppy sympathizers very high up in the hierarchy. More than one of them were very vocal advocates of the Puppies and opponents of EPH.

    Give names, please, and citations.

  22. Nicholas Whyte: Where does either of them support the Puppies? Is opposition to EPH wrongthink?

    The cited opposition to EPH includes vocal defense of the Puppies.

    I can provide a whole lot more links to quotes by both of those people to make my point. Do you really want me to do that, do you really want people re-reading those right now?

  23. Nicholas Whyte: Where?

    Please stand by. I will have your backup citations here within 24 hours.

  24. Hi, all,

    Since the old r.a.sf.fandom isn’t much read, this is the best place I can think of to ask a question. I am NOT representing any club, con, etc, just myself.

    So: if someone files a harassment complaint with an organization, and the organization follows all its rules for dealing with such… and the complainant still isn’t satisfied, what, morally and/or legally, can/should an organization do?

    I’ve looked at a couple of anti-harassment policies, and nothing covers this. given, esp. that almost no fannish organization has the money to spend on lawyers who specialize in this kind of thing – it would bankrupt almost any organization in very short order, does anyone have an answer?

  25. JJ: Sure. Those are simple questions thus simple answers but who are you?

    (Come to think of it I assume you vote? I’m not being sarcastic, and while I know this comes off as nasty it isn’t intended that way. I just generally prefer knowing who I’m talking to.)

  26. “Hampus!!! Hi! I’ve missed you, I hope you’re doing okay! “

    It depends, I’ve got covid again! Milder version this time though, fever gone since two days, so just waiting to get rid of the coughing.

  27. JJ:

    Not to mention the fact that the Sad Puppies are still active, and still hurling unprovoked, unearned vitriol and abuse at Worldcon members and Hugo finalists. People who aren’t active enough on the internet to be aware of this shouldn’t be pretending that going to Worldcons somehow makes them an expert and making uninformed claims about it.

    Thanks for the correction! I am active on the internet but do enough other things there that I haven’t kept up with everything fannish. I did Google Sad Puppies before I posted but obviously that slipped through. Could you give me a couple of links so I can catch up?

    Meanwhile, I’m pretending that having worked on Worldcons, now just attending, makes me an expert? I mean, seriously? Going against the flow is dangerous, thus somewhat frightening. So I was giving at least some creds to keep people from screaming “She’s a Puppy!”

  28. So I’ve been away and coming back, I see yet another boring troll playing word games. Everything as usual then. 🙂

  29. You have COVID again Hampus? That sucks. I’m glad it’s milder. Best wishes that you recover quickly & completely.

    (There are now many documented cases of people getting re-infected with COVID that it makes me worried.)

  30. Hampus Eckerman

    So I’ve been away and coming back, I see yet another boring troll playing word games. Everything as usual then.

    I’m assuming you’re talking about me, and being called a troll hit me over the head with a clueless stick. Obviously I’m not one, as thanking JJ for telling me I’m wrong and asking for his help correcting my ignorance makes clear. But I know perfectly well that File 770 isn’t the correct place to post what I did but I wasn’t thinking and posted it anyway. At the very least I was rude.

    Not being a troll doesn’t change the fact that what I originally said prompted the same reaction a troll would. I’m sorry. When I make a mistake it’s a doozy.

    (JJ: I still need your help so I can educate myself. But I promise not to post a reply.)

  31. Elspeth: Sure, but who are you? (Come to think of it I assume you vote? I’m not being sarcastic, and while I know this comes off as nasty it isn’t intended that way. I just generally prefer knowing who I’m talking to.)

    I’m an active member of the fan community here at File 770. I also participate in nominating and voting for the Hugo Awards every year, and I go to Worldcons most years.

     
    Elspeth: Meanwhile, I’m pretending that having worked on Worldcons, now just attending, makes me an expert? I mean, seriously? Going against the flow is dangerous, thus somewhat frightening. So I was giving at least some creds to keep people from screaming “She’s a Puppy!”

    Let’s be honest, your second comment on this thread was an attempt to establish that people here should regard you as an authority on what you said in your first comment. As I’ve pointed out to other people who brandished credentials at me in an attempt to persuade me that I should overlook any problems in what they said: I base my opinions of peoples’ expertise on the correctness of what they say, and not on how “expert” they tell me I am supposed to believe they are. The fact that you’ve been to almost all of the Worldcons in the last 20 years is really irrelevant (as is the question of my level of participation in Worldcon); what matters is the level of accuracy in what you’ve said.

    Let’s also be honest: you’ve made comments (some grossly inaccurate ones, here and elsewhere) defending the Puppies’ actions. Does that make you a Puppy? I don’t know, but in my book it makes you a Puppy supporter, certainly you’re a Puppy apologist. Why not just own that, instead of pretending otherwise?

    And these comments:
    “Which gives people plenty of time to make assumptions about my politics and jump all over me.”
    “I was giving at least some creds to keep people from screaming “She’s a Puppy!”

    are very transparent attempts to manipulate people here by claiming in advance that any comments made in contradiction to what you’ve said are by people who are politically-motivated or being unreasonable. “screaming”, “jump all over me”, really? Insulting the other commenters here in this way does not enhance your credibility.

     
    Elspeth: But I know perfectly well that File 770 isn’t the correct place to post what I did but I wasn’t thinking and posted it anyway.

    Is there somewhere which is the correct place to post things that are untrue?

     
    Also (never mind the fact that Weisskopf’s comments about Worldcon members not being “real fans” pre-dated the 2015 Puppy campaign) I’m still waiting to hear what about “the way Baen was treated those first couple of years” was so terrible. Who did what to Baen?

     
    I’ve got some answers for your other question, but I’m going to let you respond to this first.

  32. @Hampus

    It depends, I’ve got covid again! Milder version this time though, fever gone since two days, so just waiting to get rid of the coughing.

    I’m very sorry to hear this and hope you feel better soon.

    @JJ

    I’m trying to read Naomi Novik’s new novel, A Deadly Education, and I’ve got to say that I’m struggling. It’s about a Magic School for Teenagers, which is not high on my interest list to begin with, the first chapter is a massive infodump, and the entire thing appears to be written in Iambic Petulanteenager, which is nowhere on my list of favorite types of prose. I’m going to try alternating chapters with reading Cassy’s discussion group for the book, to see if I can keep going, but… I suspect that this book is Not For Me.

    Naomi Novik’s books are hit and miss for me anyway. I liked the Temeraire series, but her fairytale novels did very little for me. I haven’t read A Deadly Education yet, because the subject didn’t sound appealing. I’ve also heard from people who normally enjoy her work that they had issues with this one.

    Regarding DisCon III’s GoHs, I was aware of Toni Weisskopf’s support for the puppies, but not of Ben Yarlow’s.

  33. Elspeth, since you enjoy the things Baen publishes, perhaps you could specify which things you enjoyed most and why? No doubt you have preferences, and discussing SFF is why we’re here.

    Re: Novik, I heard A Deadly Education started its life as Harry Potter fanfic. No doubt this is an exaggerated rumor, but it did have a ring of truth for me when I read it. I found it entertaining enough, though it didn’t live up to Uprooted, for me.

  34. @JJ

    Is there somewhere which is the correct place to post things that are untrue?

    Well, there’s Parl—oh, wait. Never mind.

  35. Soon Lee: I don’t recall Ben Yalow supporting the Puppies. He didn’t like E Pluribus Hugo because it was hard to explain (therefore not as transparent?), and opposed it on that basis IIRC.

    He made several arguments against EPH; I think it was a whack-a-mole attempt to FUD the proposal to death with WSFS members by presenting every possible reason he could think of that it shouldn’t be passed, and claiming that the average person wasn’t smart enough to either understand EPH or explain it was just one of the strategies he tried.

    In one WSFS session at Sasquan, he claimed there was “no evidence” that any change to the nomination rules was needed (because having actual pornography on the Hugo ballot certainly wasn’t “evidence” 🙄 ), and he also claimed that there was no need for WSFS members to change the rules because there was “no reason” to believe that the people who had done the slating that year were going to do it again the following year (which anyone who was reading the Puppy comments on social media already knew was untrue).

    He spent a lot of time commenting at MGC as well as Hoyt’s blog (and he still posts comments on those sites to this day), and I don’t know if he was actually a full-on Puppy supporter or just swallowed their Kool-Aid — but the end result was the same: he tried very, very hard to torpedo the legislation that saved the Hugo Awards from being subjected to innumerable years of Puppy slating.

  36. Soon Lee: I don’t recall Ben Yalow supporting the Puppies. He didn’t like E Pluribus Hugo because it was hard to explain (therefore not as transparent?), and opposed it on that basis IIRC.

    Soon, Ben’s arguments regarding EPH had nothing to do with the Puppies. He doesn’t like change, and he used every argument (along with several other people) he could think of to discourage voting for it. But that doesn’t make him a puppy. And remember, just because someone (first person) agrees with an idea that a second person has, doesn’t mean the first person agrees with everything the second person says or does. I’ve known Ben for mumble-mumble years, and we agreed and disagreed on many things, and he’s still a friend.

  37. @Linda Deneroff,

    I don’t know Ben personally, but I agree that he comes across as resistant to change. As I said upthread, I don’t think he is/was a Puppy.

    There were others at the Business Meeting who spoke against E Pluribus Hugo, one in particular suggesting we shouldn’t go overboard just because of one instance of slating, suggesting it was a one-off event. I thought that was particularly wrongminded & lacking understanding of human psychology. If I can gain benefit from an action that is not illegal, without experiencing any bad consequences, why should I stop?

  38. @Anne Marble: I remember a 1980’s edition of Rogue Queen by L. Sprague de Camp that was typo’d “Rouge” on the spine. That was by Bluejay Books. I don’t recall Rogue Moon having that problem.

  39. Linda Deneroff: Soon, Ben’s arguments regarding EPH had nothing to do with the Puppies. He doesn’t like change, and he used every argument he could think of to discourage voting for it. But that doesn’t make him a puppy.

    Is it possible that despite being a frequent commenter on Puppy blogs, Mr. Yalow’s motivation to try to torpedo EPH any way he could was simply a dislike of change, rather than the intent to allow the Puppies to keep being able to control the Hugo ballot with works of their choice? It’s possible — though it certainly looks (and did look) like the latter to someone who doesn’t know him well enough to think otherwise.

    For me, his motivation takes secondary importance to the actual effect of his actions, if he had gotten what he wanted. What he wanted would have enabled the Puppies to continue controlling the Hugo ballot and putting garbage on it. For that reason, I and some other people have real issues with what he did. If it was more important to him to prevent any changes than it was to protect the integrity of the Hugos, then in my view that’s only marginally less bad than if his reason had been full-on support of the Puppies.

  40. JJ:

    Elspeth: Sure, but who are you? (Come to think of it I assume you vote? I’m not being sarcastic, and while I know this comes off as nasty it isn’t intended that way. I just generally prefer knowing who I’m talking to.)

    I’m an active member of the fan community here at File 770. I also participate in nominating and voting for the Hugo Awards every year, and I go to Worldcons most years.

    Thanks. I know you post a lot here but was trying to figure out if you were another person I know. I also know someone – different person who frequently comments o Worldcons, often intelligently, without have been to one in years.

    Elspeth: Meanwhile, I’m pretending that having worked on Worldcons, now just attending, makes me an expert? I mean, seriously? Going against the flow is dangerous, thus somewhat frightening. So I was giving at least some creds to keep people from screaming “She’s a Puppy!”

    Let’s be honest, your second comment on this thread was an attempt to establish that people here should regard you as an authority on what you said in your first comment.

    Let’s be honest, I’m honestly not clever enough for it to have occurred to me. But you’re proving what I said about people jumping all over me: twice now you’ve publicly said that I’m manipulative and am trying to establish myself as an authority.

    [Typeface goes wonky here for some reason][Or did when I was reviewing this. We’ll see]

    And these comments:
    “Which gives people plenty of time to make assumptions about my politics and jump all over me.”
    “I was giving at least some creds to keep people from screaming “She’s a Puppy!”
    are very transparent attempts to manipulate people here by claiming in advance that any comments made in contradiction to what you’ve said are by people who are politically-motivated or being unreasonable. “screaming”, “jump all over me”, really? Insulting the other commenters here in this way does not enhance your credibility.

    JJ, I’ve already pointed out that you’re proving my point about people jumping all over me. I also don’t think personal attacks are appropriate. Saying that I’m trying to preempt people who disagree with me without observing, or commenting upon, what happened when you yourself disagreed with me takes it beyond logic. So I’m going to bow out. You can claim it’s for whatever reason you choose but I’m just, once again, being boringly direct. (If you want to attack me in private, via email so it’s not irritating or distracting other people, that’s fine.)

  41. Elspeth: I’ve already pointed out that you’re proving my point about people jumping all over me

    It seems to me that you view anyone contradicting anything you say as “jumping all over you.”

    Do you normally just hang out in places where no one dares to contradict you?

    It seems to me that if you could back up any of the things on which you’ve been questioned, you would — but you can’t, so instead you blame it on me “jumping all over you”. You started it with the personal attacks, claiming that people here were politically-motivated, claiming that people here would “scream” and “jump all over you” — and when instead you got reasoned responses pointing out the manipulative language of your comments, you flounced.

  42. Jayn,

    Elspeth, since you enjoy the things Baen publishes, perhaps you could specify which things you enjoyed most and why? No doubt you have preferences, and discussing SFF is why we’re here.

    Thank you, tremendously, for asking about me about SFF!

    [A placeholder: I wanted to thank you but it’s 2:30 AM here]

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